Utopia Temple
Main Forum Page Register an Account for Free! Calendar Frequently Asked Questions about this Board View New Posts Advanced Search Login
  Utopia Temple Forums > General Discussions > Polls Heaven

View Poll Results: Should Abortion become illegal?
Should be legal on request 22 30.56%
Should be illegal with the exception for rape, incest, mother's physical health etc etc 13 18.06%
Should be legal but illegal after the mother enters a certain trimester 30 41.67%
Should be illegal with no exceptions 5 6.94%
Other. 2 2.78%
Who voted? Voters: 72
You may not vote on this poll

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Post New Thread Reply
Author Thread
Posts: 16/19
(23-Nov-2008 at 22:29)


Should Abortion be illegal?

Right now in social studies, I am doing a persuasive essay on abortion from a pro-choice perspective. I wish to use this poll from this website as a possible source on my topic as well because I hope to get a variety of answers almost all of my classmates and friends are pro-life. Also, I'd like your opinions on my report before I turn it in next month.
From my understanding, abortion is legal in the US and heavily debated and the Republicans want it banned but when they had control of Congress in the past, they took no action against it.
Attached Files
File Type: doc 1.5 Rough Draft.doc (29.0 KB, 10 views)
#1  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Mori600 Add Mori600 to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 5332/5486
Donated $11.20
(24-Nov-2008 at 00:36)


Mori600,

I believe abortion should be legal without exception, but should be discouraged without exception.

As the father of a teenage girl I'm accutely aware of teenage pregnancy (I have two teenage nephews/neices who have made babies too). In fact, I was merely 21 when my daughter was born.

I'm in favor of birth control as a means of birth control, not abortion. However I would never impose my views upon others. If some people feel that they're capable of erradicating human life, who am I to stand in the way.

I shouldn't ever dictate morality in that regard. Once you're born however, I want my say.

Man is the only animal that blushes, or needs to.-- Mark Twain
#2  
View Public Profile Visit Michael1's homepage Find more posts by Michael1 Add Michael1 to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 4754/4829
(24-Nov-2008 at 05:54)


I think the key question is when does life begin?

Once life begins, that life deserves legal protection from murder. However, even if we do say life begins some time within the womb if the baby presents a REAL and serious threat to the mother's life (ie. not just depression) one should be allowed to have an abortion on the same rationale as self defense laws allow you to gun down someone threatening your life.

Up until life begins abortion should be both legal and neither encouraged nor discouraged. It's nothing more than a fleshy growth to be disposed of at will.

Personally, I think the beginning of life could begin at any number of identifiable points. Birth, under a quasi-theological perspective that the first breath is when God breaths life into a human. Heart beat, because that's a common medical means of determining death/life. Central nervous system because perhaps the capacity for thought and pain is what creates human life. Conception because that is the first point at which there is a new whole "human" that will likely be born barring complications or intervention. Heck there could even be some point between conception and birth or beyond when God actually confers a soul.

However, given that we don't really know when a new life is created, I say it is best to err on the side of protecting life. Perhaps it is inconveient to carry a baby to term, but there are a lot of situations in life where the lives of other people are inconvenient. We protect those lives none the less.
#3  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Royal Assassin3 Add Royal Assassin3 to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 588/765
(24-Nov-2008 at 06:03)


First, I would never be able to have an abortion but I don't believe it is my job to make a decision over what someone else's conscience dictates.

BUT...

1. I do not believe abortions should be a form of birth control.
2. And once the fetus is of gestation to be able to survive out of the womb (I believe it is 20ish weeks or so), it should be illegal to abort.

----------------------------------------
})i({~flutterby~ })i({

Alliance Rankings Administration
irc.Utonet.org #alliancerankings
#4  
View Public Profile Visit mdmflutterby's homepage Find more posts by mdmflutterby Add mdmflutterby to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 2127/2297
(24-Nov-2008 at 10:21)


Re: Should Abortion be illegal?

Originally Posted by Royal Assassin3: View Post
I think the key question is when does life begin?
I think you are mistaken. Life an sich is not particularly special. We kill bugs because they annoy us, we kill animals for food, we kill trees for wood. All of these are forms of life. The question is not when does life begin? but when does human life begin?, where human here is used in the moral sense of the term and not the biological sense. On that regard, I completely fail to see how an unconscious, completely dependent bunch of growing cells could be called human life in the proper sense of the term.

Hence, I think there's absolutely no problem with abortion. I do think however that it should be discouraged to some extent, but that's mainly because there are so many people who take offense.

Modern world I'm not pleased to meet you

You just bring me down
#5  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Caelis666 Add Caelis666 to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 522/742
(24-Nov-2008 at 13:40)


Re: Should Abortion be illegal?

Originally Posted by Michael1: View Post
I believe abortion should be legal without exception, but should be discouraged without exception.
I think that sums it up pretty well.

I also agree with Caelis that the question at stake isn't really when life begins, but rather where humanity begins. The way i see it, there is instrinsic value to all life, but there simultaneously is a hierarchy to it, and human life is the most actualized form of it. We thus definitely have a special responsibility to protect life once it has reached 'humanness' (self-awareness, morality). Another important part of that very self-awareness to me however, is that, recognizing the interrelatedness of life, you extend that healthy regard for life to non-human lifeforms. That to me includes trees, bugs, animals, as well as that little clump of insignificant cells that starts off human life. None of those should be treated like human beings, but all of them should be recognized as being something more than mere 'inanimate matter'. I think reducing all non-human life to non-life is as big a philosophical mistake as putting all non-human life on equal footing with human life.

Your brain is unique in the history of the universe. Use it wisely.
#6  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Dusk Illz Add Dusk Illz to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 2128/2297
(24-Nov-2008 at 19:00)


Re: Should Abortion be illegal?

Originally Posted by Dusk Illz: View Post
I think reducing all non-human life to non-life is as big a philosophical mistake as putting all non-human life on equal footing with human life.
What are your criteria?

Modern world I'm not pleased to meet you

You just bring me down
#7  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Caelis666 Add Caelis666 to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 3044/3642
(24-Nov-2008 at 23:12)


All I can do is hope that women who would do this, and men who support it, feel ashamed of themselves if/when they have their first (non-aborted) child (poor fucking luck for that kid) if not sooner. If someone isn't ready to take responsibility for something they're planning to do, maybe it's a great fucking idea not to do it!

If someone wants to take a risk, they should deal with the consequences like an adult. I'm absolutely sickened and repulsed by the notion of it. If someone didn't choose to have sex or if someone's life's at risk, then yeah, I support abortion. In regards to people who put themselves in that sort of position willingly, I have no sympathy for people who take the cowards way out of problems they have brought upon themselves. Especially in regards to women who have had multiple abortions or men who have encouraged abortion multiple times. If someone does it once, I can understand them not being in the right state of mind to make the decent decision.

Just the idea that it's so common and so many people feel it's perfectly justified makes me want to puke, but I suppose wearing a condom or taking a pill is far too much of an effort compared to killing an unborn child for some people.

Save me the typical "it's a woman's right to choose to get herself pregnant and choose to kill her unborn child," "I'm going to pretend to talk to my sperm," or "let me wrongly accuse you of being religious" lack of an argument, please.

So all in all here's how I feel about abortion:
--It should be legal for any woman who is in a life threatening position
--It should be legal for any woman who claims to have been raped
--It should be legally limited to once
--It should be discouraged
--People who can't control their sexual behaviour should learn how to put on a condom or swallow a pill.

If all else fails, call someone a troll.
that can be fixed... /

Last edited by Greeney, 24-Nov-2008 at 23:13.
#8  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Greeney Add Greeney to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 1317/1971
(25-Nov-2008 at 03:00)


Quote:
All I can do is hope that women who would do this, and men who support it, feel ashamed of themselves if/when they have their first (non-aborted) child (poor fucking luck for that kid) if not sooner. If someone isn't ready to take responsibility for something they're planning to do, maybe it's a great fucking idea not to do it!

If someone wants to take a risk, they should deal with the consequences like an adult. I'm absolutely sickened and repulsed by the notion of it. If someone didn't choose to have sex or if someone's life's at risk, then yeah, I support abortion. In regards to people who put themselves in that sort of position willingly, I have no sympathy for people who take the cowards way out of problems they have brought upon themselves. Especially in regards to women who have had multiple abortions or men who have encouraged abortion multiple times. If someone does it once, I can understand them not being in the right state of mind to make the decent decision.

Just the idea that it's so common and so many people feel it's perfectly justified makes me want to puke, but I suppose wearing a condom or taking a pill is far too much of an effort compared to killing an unborn child for some people.

Save me the typical "it's a woman's right to choose to get herself pregnant and choose to kill her unborn child," "I'm going to pretend to talk to my sperm," or "let me wrongly accuse you of being religious" lack of an argument, please.

So all in all here's how I feel about abortion:
--It should be legal for any woman who is in a life threatening position
--It should be legal for any woman who claims to have been raped
--It should be legally limited to once
--It should be discouraged
--People who can't control their sexual behaviour should learn how to put on a condom or swallow a pill.
And what if contraception fails? You still haven't addressed this anywhere. Should we all become abstinate?

Quote:
--It should be legal for any woman who claims to have been raped
ANY woman that CLAIMS to be raped? There's a pretty glaring loophole right there...

Quote:
--It should be legally limited to once
...but I suppose you stitch it up here by ensuring they can't lie about being raped more than once... oh, except what about someone who gets impregnated through rape a second time? Tough shit, I guess...

You are letting your emotions take over, and you are erring. Let reason prevail. If that leads you to the same conclusion, then fine, but don't let your emotional side rule...

Quote:
"I'm going to pretend to talk to my sperm,"
Pretend? You accuse me of lying? =D

------------------------------------

Just as a note about at which stage abortions should be disallowed... I think it is pretty reasonable to expect someone to make a decision within a week of discovering they are pregnant, regardless of which trimester it is in.

Tax collectors are a valid military target - chobham

Last edited by Spectre19, 25-Nov-2008 at 03:03.
#9  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Spectre19 Add Spectre19 to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 2129/2297
(25-Nov-2008 at 08:22)


Re: Should Abortion be illegal?

Originally Posted by Spectre19: View Post
Just as a note about at which stage abortions should be disallowed... I think it is pretty reasonable to expect someone to make a decision within a week of discovering they are pregnant, regardless of which trimester it is in.
To be honest, I do sort of get why people need more than a week. On the contrary of what Greeney seems to think, having an abortion is not an easy decision to make. For almost no one.

Modern world I'm not pleased to meet you

You just bring me down
#10  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Caelis666 Add Caelis666 to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 537/616
(25-Nov-2008 at 09:42)


One thing about giving abortions to women who claim to be raped. Maybe they should produce a copy or something of a police report of the rape. This could perhaps help cut down on abortions for women who only claim to be raped.

The only thing I could really see would be that the woman would not want to expose the identity of the rapist... but then that itself seems like a very sad situation.

I also agree with the needing more than a week. Many times it might take a week or more for the woman to even figure out if she's pregnant.

I miss Runey...
Band is good! Band is great! Band is how I got a date!
War Damn Eagle!
I love Reputation! Love it! Gimme Gimme Gimme!!! Please.
#11  
View Public Profile Find more posts by StarOwl Add StarOwl to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 4601/4773
Donated $9.31
(25-Nov-2008 at 11:39)


Re: Should Abortion be illegal?

Originally Posted by StarOwl: View Post
One thing about giving abortions to women who claim to be raped. Maybe they should produce a copy or something of a police report of the rape. This could perhaps help cut down on abortions for women who only claim to be raped.

The only thing I could really see would be that the woman would not want to expose the identity of the rapist... but then that itself seems like a very sad situation.
Maybe, but IMO this whole line of thought is pointless, as it will only apply if abortions aren't allowed except in cases of rape/risk to mother/etc. And that basically means most third world countries and Ireland.

Quote:
I also agree with the needing more than a week. Many times it might take a week or more for the woman to even figure out if she's pregnant.
Definitely. Some people seem to think that just because the someone's end result is having an abortion, they have to have taken it lightly, and probably used is a contraception.
#12  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Nimon Add Nimon to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 1325/1971
(25-Nov-2008 at 14:06)


Quote:
Many times it might take a week or more for the woman to even figure out if she's pregnant.
Well, I did say a week AFTER she finds out

Anyway... you guys are right, I probably didn't think it through too much. I don't mean to imply it is a decision to take lightly, but I also don't like the idea of dilly-dallying around about it.

Tax collectors are a valid military target - chobham
#13  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Spectre19 Add Spectre19 to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 523/742
(25-Nov-2008 at 16:15)


Re: Should Abortion be illegal?

Originally Posted by Caelis666: View Post
What are your criteria?
The model i think by is Life as a holarchy; an unfolding process wherein every consecutive step transcends as well as includes its predecessor. The whole has intrinsic value, but every developmental step also has 'added' value you might say. So, for example, both a tree and a bird are a perfect expression of the principle of Life, but i would rather eat the tree than eat the bird. In that case the exact criteria, if you would want to explicate them, are probably the evolutionary elements that seperate tree from bird; sensation, perception, locomotion, impulse, and such?

In the same vein, if forced to choose I would rather kill the bird than the monkey that feeds on it; the monkey again being a higher step in evolution's ladder.. In that case the exact criteria would probably be the capacity for emotion and a primitive self-consciousness (and any other ability that monkeys have developed but birds do not, i'm not a biologist in any way).

Looking at monkeys and humans, it's yet again the same distinction; humans include everything that monkeys have, but also transcend them by having developed symbols, concepts, a more elaborate self-awareness, and so on. That makes humans more 'valuable', but by no means makes every form of life leading up to humans 'worthless'.. To the contrary, there'd be no us without them. We're like the big chain of life wherein every link rests on the former.

It seems to me that this results in a very healthy, nuanced, and realistic outlook on life and its value. And to now bring it back to the question of abortion that started this: a human embryo would in my conceptualization be the least developed form of the most developed species. In other words, very high in potential, very low in actuality. A potential human being, but as it stands little more than a fertilized cell.. With none of the abilities yet that make a human humane. Anybody considering having an abortion would have to balance those elements. Hence in my view abortion should be legal, because something as low in actuality as a fertilized human cell should have no 'human rights'. That would be a gross mischaracterization of what we constructed human rights for as a society. Simultaneously abortion should be discouraged, because parents should be well aware that what you kill is the embryonal beginnings of a full human being.

Your brain is unique in the history of the universe. Use it wisely.

Last edited by Dusk Illz, 25-Nov-2008 at 16:16.
#14  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Dusk Illz Add Dusk Illz to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 17/19
(25-Nov-2008 at 22:03)


Dusk Illz, yes life is valuable but in many cases when a woman or man is forced to care for the unwanted child, they abuse the child and reports said that if the child is a male, the child would usually knock up another girl and so on. If i knew that my mother was raped and is unable to be a good parent to me and I have to live with her until I'm 18 and by then, she probably would have enough influence on me to make me a bad person, I'd rather be aborted. Many of you believe that there is a heaven and the baby will be there. Most of the pro-life politicians talk about banning abortion but they do not talk about helping the mother or the unwanted child. I don't know what happens to the rape victim's child but my guess is that they are given little support from the government. Yes, if a woman gets knocked up which most likely their fault and if they want an abortion but cannot get one because it's banned, I expect the government to help them out rather than to mourn for those poor fetuses.

By the way, another thing the government does is mourn for those poor "babies" but they do not give them healthcare. "Hello little baby, I am glad you were not aborted but I will not give you healthcare so please try not to die in the real world."
#15  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Mori600 Add Mori600 to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 3046/3642
(25-Nov-2008 at 23:53)


Re: Should Abortion be illegal?

Originally Posted by Mori600: View Post
yes life is valuable but in many cases when a woman or man is forced to care for the unwanted child, they abuse the child and reports said that if the child is a male, the child would usually knock up another girl and so on.
Continuing the cycle of life is not as bad as people make it out to be.

Quote:
If i knew that my mother was raped and is unable to be a good parent to me and I have to live with her until I'm 18 and by then, she probably would have enough influence on me to make me a bad person, I'd rather be aborted.
I hate it so much when people go to the rape argument. It just feels like they've totally run out of anything else to argue. What percent of abortions are caused by rape? under 2%? As far as I'm concerned, abortions and abortions because of rape are completely different issues. Many people who are anti-abortion, don't mind abortion when it is [real] rape [and not the I've been raped because I had sex willingly while I was drunk].


Quote:
Many of you believe that there is a heaven and the baby will be there.
I feel like that is saying it's acceptable to murder because we believe the post-vagina individual will be in heaven.

Quote:
Most of the pro-life politicians talk about banning abortion but they do not talk about helping the mother or the unwanted child.
Which they should be doing, but politicians aren't looked upon very highly for keeping double standards to a minimum.

Quote:
Yes, if a woman gets knocked up which most likely their fault and if they want an abortion but cannot get one because it's banned, I expect the government to help them out rather than to mourn for those poor fetuses.
Yes, I do too, but I expect a parent to mourn his/her unborn child more than I expect a government to do so.

Quote:
By the way, another thing the government does is mourn for those poor "babies" but they do not give them healthcare. "Hello little baby, I am glad you were not aborted but I will not give you healthcare so please try not to die in the real world."
Unfortunately, the people who are against abortion argue about universal healthcare between them. For example, this is my second biggest problem with RA3. One thing we both agree on is that abortion in most cases is wrong. One thing we disagree on is whether people who are more fortunate should be obligated to share a fraction of their fortune (that they will live just fine without), to benefit the whole of society. I do not believe you can prove to me that there is a correlation between anti-abortion and anti-healthcare.

Quote:
Likewise, people feel guilty, but they still do not give them life.
And they need to convince themselves that they have no reason to feel guilty as well.
And rapists need to convince themselves that they have no reason to feel guilty as well... err, wait a minute...

Usually people don't feel guilty unless they're doing something they know deep down is wrong. When people push that feeling away, they become less humane. At least, that's how I feel about people.

Originally Posted by Caelis:
To be honest, I do sort of get why people need more than a week. On the contrary of what Greeney seems to think, having an abortion is not an easy decision to make. For almost no one.
I actually do know it's a difficult choice. I also believe it's a difficult choice for (many) people to decide to rob someone. It doesn't make it right or any less wrong. What I actually stated was that I have no respect for people when they take the easy way out rather than taking responsibility for their actions.

Originally Posted by Spectre:
And what if contraception fails? You still haven't addressed this anywhere.
You deal with it like a decent, responsible person; you know, the type of person you were under the impression you were before getting laid. You knew the risks, if you weren't prepared for them you weren't mature enough to get laid in the first place. Usually, nobody first it upon the individual; deal with it like an adult.

Quote:
Should we all become abstinate?
No, you should raise the life you've co-created.

It is better to have a million more people who are abstinence than a million more people who go through an abortion.

Quote:
ANY woman that CLAIMS to be raped? There's a pretty glaring loophole right there...
Starowl covered it for me, but yes, I don't believe a woman should be forced to have a baby unless it can be proven that she wasn't raped. This does not mean "make it legal to any woman who says she has been raped," it means "if a woman calls 9-1-1 and tells them that she has been raped, they should be willing to get a doctor to find out if she is pregnant and if so, allow her to decide whether to abort the baby." What Starowl says, however, is a much better criteria.

Quote:
...but I suppose you stitch it up here by ensuring they can't lie about being raped more than once... oh, except what about someone who gets impregnated through rape a second time? Tough shit, I guess...
I actually liked reading your entire response other than this quote, but this is one of those times I feel you're just acting like an ass for trying to put words in my mouth. If you asked rather than assumed, I would have told you both a mothers life or rape situation takes priority and the second time is only regarding the second time in which the woman chose to put herself in that position.

Quote:
You are letting your emotions take over, and you are erring. Let reason prevail. If that leads you to the same conclusion, then fine, but don't let your emotional side rule...
No, I say you are on the emotional side of this debate. I feel pretty confident that you are supporting what your body (exception to hormones) is telling you is wrong.

I might let emotional words come out in my arguments, but everything, especially this, I have thought out rationally. I am not pro-abortion, because I know I would be responsible enough to raise a child if I impregnated my girlfriend and I expect the least from each and every other person who chose to have sex or wouldn't die from it. I believe many people here (not all, mind you) tend to try to hide their emotions by using words like "fetus" or "cells" to make it seem more rational than emotional.

I am against abortion because it is the easy way out of something that somewhere deep down makes you feel guilty. I am against it because I feel that the only living people that deserve to die are the ones who feel no remorse for killing others. I am against it because I feel the youngest should be the best protected rather than killed with barely any remorse. I am against (if/) because they have brought it upon themselves. I am against it, because less deep down than most people here, my brain, heart, and stomach all agree that it's utterly sick, twisted, and I'm repulsed by it. I am against it because I believe the future is going to look at us for allowing it, in the same way that we look at the nazi's. I am against it, because I don't find it any better than slamming a just-born baby against a wall. I am against is because I know when a parent of an aborted child has their first post-vagina child, they'll regret it.

Not sarcastically: Is there any reason you are for (non-rape & non-lethal situation) abortion, without using a word synonymous to "fetus" as an excuse, other than:
--classifying a pre-vagina individual as less significant than not being inconvenienced for 9 months?
--believing one body that won't be harmed is more significant than a body that can't survive?
--placing financial welfare above one's own child

Quote:
Anyway... you guys are right, I probably didn't think it through too much. I don't mean to imply it is a decision to take lightly, but I also don't like the idea of dilly-dallying around about it.
Why not, isn't a parasite irrelevant?
This seems to suggest that somewhere deep down it does indeed bother you.

I think you would feel guilty if you suggested to a girlfriend to have an abortion. Maybe not for long, maybe you would push the feeling away, but I think at first you would know it was wrong. Then you would probably attempt to justify it. I don't think a good person could help but feel guilty for what they would be about to do; for good reason.

Quote:
"I'm going to pretend to talk to my sperm,"
Pretend? You accuse me of lying? =D
After you have your first child, ask him/her if s/he wishes s/he was aborted (when s/he isn't in his/her emo-phase). Then I'll care what your sperm had to say about it.





IRT Dusk Illz:
Interesting post.

If all else fails, call someone a troll.
that can be fixed... /

Last edited by Greeney, 25-Nov-2008 at 23:56.
#16  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Greeney Add Greeney to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 4602/4773
Donated $9.31
(26-Nov-2008 at 03:13)


Re: Should Abortion be illegal?

Originally Posted by Greeney: View Post
After you have your first child, ask him/her if s/he wishes s/he was aborted (when s/he isn't in his/her emo-phase). Then I'll care what your sperm had to say about it.
By that line of reasoning, you should aim to have as many children as physically possible. After all, any baby you don't have is a potential human being. If you expect Spectre to visualize something like that, then you should have no problem visualizing yourself asking your hypothetical ninth child if he/she wishes you decided not to have more than eight children (when he/she isn't in their emo-phase).
#17  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Nimon Add Nimon to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 3047/3642
(26-Nov-2008 at 03:30)


Re: Should Abortion be illegal?

Originally Posted by Nimon: View Post
By that line of reasoning, you should aim to have as many children as physically possible. After all, any baby you don't have is a potential human being. If you expect Spectre to visualize something like that, then you should have no problem visualizing yourself asking your hypothetical ninth child if he/she wishes you decided not to have more than eight children (when he/she isn't in their emo-phase).
So, your argument here is trying to convince me that abortion is acceptable because there might be one child out of (how many do you think?) who wishes s/he wasn't born? Unfortunately for your argument here, I'm pretty sure if you gave everyone the choice to live or not - more than 99.9% would want to stay alive. Somehow, I doubt that percentage would dwindle if all those aborted babies weren't vacuumed out by someone who thought she was mature enough to have sex.

But to answer your question, if I did have a ninth child who wished s/he was never born, and not in his/her emo phase - I still wouldn't regret my girlfriend (wife by then, hopefully) refraining from having an abortion.

If all else fails, call someone a troll.
that can be fixed... /

Last edited by Greeney, 26-Nov-2008 at 03:33.
#18  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Greeney Add Greeney to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 867/867
Donated $0.40
(26-Nov-2008 at 05:33)


The poll is Biased. Where is my legal without any acceptions or hassels box?

Signature suspended by Starfriend for violating the forum's rules.
#19  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Jasmine X Add Jasmine X to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Posts: 1981/2035
(26-Nov-2008 at 05:34)


Re: Should Abortion be illegal?

Originally Posted by Greeney: View Post
So, your argument here is trying to convince me that abortion is acceptable because there might be one child out of (how many do you think?) who wishes s/he wasn't born? Unfortunately for your argument here, I'm pretty sure if you gave everyone the choice to live or not - more than 99.9% would want to stay alive. Somehow, I doubt that percentage would dwindle if all those aborted babies weren't vacuumed out by someone who thought she was mature enough to have sex.

But to answer your question, if I did have a ninth child who wished s/he was never born, and not in his/her emo phase - I still wouldn't regret my girlfriend (wife by then, hopefully) refraining from having an abortion.
You misunderstood Nimon's post. What he was saying is that this 9th child WOULD say they wanted to be born. That's the point. So basically, you should be having AS MANY CHILDREN AS POSSIBLE at all times. Any moment in which you aren't procreating, you're murdering potential individuals, all of whom would conceivably desire life if raised to maturity. If you went out and impregnated ten women right now, in twenty years chances are if you asked those ten children if they would have rathered you'd not had them, they'd probably appreciate your gift of life (unless, as pointed out, they're going through an emo phase). By not going out and impregnating as many women as possible this very instant, you're preventing all those future children from existing, you cruel, heartless bastard.

The point being, what could have been is vastly different from what is. That is why abortions after, say, the fifteenth year are not legal, compared for instance to while the individual in question is still a lump of organic matter without a central nervous system.

Edited to add:

Originally Posted by Jasmine X: View Post
The poll is Biased. Where is my legal without any acceptions or hassels box?
I believe the first option covers that perfectly... unless of course you're arguing for the right to unrequested abortions...?

"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use."
-Soren Kierkegaard
"Those who know don't say, and those who say don't know."
- Lao Tzu
More Quotes...

Last edited by Syke, 26-Nov-2008 at 05:40.
Edit reason: Abortion is a wasted opportunity- read "A Modest Proposal" by Jonathan Swift for a much more practical solution.
#20  
View Public Profile Find more posts by Syke Add Syke to your Buddy List Reply with Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump:

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Parties to be illegal in Miami? KnightoftheNite Respectable General Discussions 10 20-Jan-2007 13:08
Abortion, again filcher Respectable General Discussions 6 31-May-2006 20:24
Government Imposition of Values: Walmart and Abortion Royal Assassin3 Respectable General Discussions 47 17-Feb-2006 04:11
Abortion T-Shirt Michael1 Respectable General Discussions 50 31-Jul-2004 05:08
Abortion Lord Hawk The Lunatic Asylum 26 04-Apr-2003 21:36


All times are GMT+1. The time now is 22:41.

Powered by vBulletin (modified)
Copyright ©2000-2006, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.