[Admiral S3]

Quote:

(Originally posted by Avantari)

Another thing I would like to know is:

What were the proofs that AA based their accusations on MeMo supporting Daimyo on?

Avantari I was under the assumption that the MeMo issue and the Daimyo issue where over how ever as I stated in your other thread. (Help being GBed by an AA KD.) i stated that if you wiosh I shall share some of my reports froom before the daimyo conflict. Please go read my post on this issue in the other thread for more detials.

[NeoTaz]

Ok...so diplomacy failed (however it should not so easily

But then force was called in. However everything is relative and it is the sheer scale of the assualt that makes it wrong (in my opinion)...You could have easily retalled like for like or ##:## even...in my opinion ##:## odds and longer are/were uncalled for and probably would NOT have happened if Methos had not taken personal offence to WORDS spoken towards him...

[Admiral S3]

Quote:

(Originally posted by NeoTaz)

Very true, you can't be watching out all the time. However once something has been brought to your attention, proceeding the actual event then you can be held accountable and should deal with the wrongdoing person properly by yourselves. In otherwords they should be held accountable within the walls of AA. I am not sure if this happens or if they are given a slap on the wrist or if they are protected and not punished? Perhaps you can enlighten me Admiral ^_^

Actually we deal with these type of actions rather harshly indeed. Using the very same tactics we use on anyone else. Yes that is right we treat our triators and those who have mislead us and have commited seriously wrongful actions against non-target KDs in much the same manner as we do with any one else that offends us.

Primarily we prephere of course to simpley remove them from the AA, however if thier actions warent stronger measures death can and will be used as a means to enforce AA policy.

[Avantari]

Of course I'm allways interested in knowing facts (both good and bad) about the alliance I'm in so please do provide with those reports.

However, your apology in the other thread makes up for alot of the pain your alliance caused my kingdom. Thank you.

[Admiral S3]

Quote:

(Originally posted by NeoTaz)

Ok...so diplomacy failed (however it should not so easily

But then force was called in. However everything is relative and it is the sheer scale of the assualt that makes it wrong (in my opinion)...You could have easily retalled like for like or ##:## even...in my opinion ##:## odds and longer are/were uncalled for and probably would NOT have happened if Methos had not taken personal offence to WORDS spoken towards him...

Ok that would be all well and fine with one excpetion. We undertake similar problems almost dayly. We go in quick and hard to force a peaceful resolution, so we can move on to the next offender. We do not use our force for the enjoyment of it contrary to popular belief. Obvicously it slows down our gorwth and causes additional stress on many people when we do it (namely me).

However the fact still remains we use our forces to help our members, I still want to know why that is wrong, when it is not wrong or less wrong for another alliance (or even single KD's) to use force upon us in excess of what the game was intended for? I do grant that we use a large amount of it when we do come, but I see no reason not to, when tommarow we may very well have another person, KD or alliance attempting to do the same to another member.

[NeoTaz]

I believe it is wrong to use such odds if you are in an alliance, call on friends, etc. I am not getting at you for being an alliance...purely for your actions ^_^

Also I am adament that Methos had extreme pleasure in sitting down and instigating the ##:## attack

[Avantari]

Admiral, you still haven't answered my first question:

Why is it that AA demands destruction of provinces for calling AA members bad names, while AA members themselves can call others names without even having to apologize???

[Tiny Tim]

Quote:

I still want to know why that is wrong, when it is not wrong or less wrong for another alliance (or even single KD's) to use force upon us in excess of what the game was intended for? I do grant that we use a large amount of it when we do come, but I see no reason not to, when tommarow we may very well have another person, KD or alliance attempting to do the same to another member.

It is wrong and using other alliances as an excuse is also wrong. ALL alliances are wrong when use their combined forcec in Utopia. Utopia was created for alliances called KINGDOMS where up to 25 people can interact and play together. Now you said thet Mehul had no problems with kingdom based alliances. Well time to read the latest interview maybe?

Quote from Mehul in interview made by Digger

Quote:

My feelings on alliances are the same as trading. There are other games for that (including Earth: 2025), but Utopia is not designed for it and actually has a built-in alliance system within your own Kingdom.

So why have an Alliance? Mehul has stated he dont likes them?

No you read my sig and say HEY you are in an alliance, well before you flame it, ask what we are

[Dave of Spam]

haha no-one's escaped the YYA everybody knows 'em

[Admiral S3]

Avantari:

It was a diplomatic demand. One that could have very easily been negotiated away from should the meeting have gone better. This is one instance where life and this game imitae one another. The larger power demanding thier ultimate request. While the smaller power attempts to widle that demand down. I truely believe that it was basically like the straw that broke the camels back.

[Admiral S3]

Tiny tim:

Although I consider you post to be more spam then substance as alliance are and will forever be part of this game. I will however comment on this. That alliances are in thier basic design ment to help ensure that the rules are followed as Mehul has yet to impliment any such idea into the game. Most alliances are defensive. Defensive means they will not attack unless provoked or forsee a serious threat to thier members saftey.

Until Mehul makes any real stride towards ensuring that KD war reamin fair and honest and actually institutes any real GB protection alliances will be needed to help ensure that thier members are protected when they are wrongfully hurt.

[Dave of Spam]

alliances arent part of the game - are they coded in?
did mehul mention them in the guide?
for you info the answer is no, dont get me wrong im not against alliances they add an extra dimension to the game i think but dont make the mistake of thinking what you justr said about them

[Admiral S3]

Dave:

They are a part of the game. No they where not intended to be here. Yet they are a part of the game. A fact of utopian life is that at some piont you will encounter an alliance, weather for the good or bad of your KD and your provence and you your self. They are here, thus a part of the game.

[Dave of Spam]

im gonna be a real jackass over this - they are not anywhere in the code and are not a part of the game - they are part of playing the game but remember what the game itself is so

[Tiny Tim]

You want substance, ok then i will bring out the flamethrower.

Scenario;

Happend to a friend not me, i was at his place and i saw everything.

1 on 1 war where one kingdom has the upper hand and wants to go for a surrender, they do the standard procedure of focusing on the monarch, they keep her at 100 peasants and can kill here just about when ever they want.

What happends?

The kingdom is tagged and poeple from another kingdom also tagged AA (suprised?) starts sending messages to back off or AA will interfere.

This was a standard war where "my" kingdom did not send any allies, they used the teamwork of the KINGDOM to fight the war.



The funny thing is that trough my Utopian experiance have i fought a few wars and the ONLY time the opposing kingdom has brought in allies is when they have been tagged, i have never personnally experienced that with AA and i give you credit for that though i have faught a few (not beacuse the AA tag but beacuse it was a good target).

Is`it not so that most of times you have to "defend" your AA allies it is situations where things occured beacuse they are infact tagged AA?

Quote:

That alliances are in thier basic design ment to help ensure that the rules are followed as Mehul has yet to impliment any such idea into the game

Are you kidding me? So beacuse Mehul has not implemented that you can have say for an example more then one account is it ok for me to start 10? Dont make up hte rules as go dear Sir.

Quote:

Defensive means they will not attack unless provoked or forsee a serious threat to thier members saftey

Will there be any wars if everyone used your rules with 20 kingdom allies? Who are you to judge over what my kingdom does when we are at war? If an AA kingdom cant take the heat in a 1on1 war then suit themselfs. I have been hurt plenty of times war but thats the game.


Sorry for the messy post but i have little time since i am at work.

[Dave of Spam]

same as what happened to my old queen a few ages back - we're currently wasting an AA kd - i wonder if AA will get involved btw my kd is not in an alliance so we cant call in allies

[NeoTaz]

but they consider such action against a province as infair...even if it is a ##:## war. As for saying Alliances are part of the game, they exist, they'll always be there so what's wrong with it? A lot of things exist that are wrong...Won't bother listing them as the analogies will likely be bad

Take crime for instance...hence police etc. have been employed.

Now in keeping with the concept of something virtual imitating life. Along to utopia comes Zea, CoS and others....and other such vigilanties ^_^ , the police being Mehul. Unless Mehul says alliances are banned (the only reason he doesn't is that it would be unimplemntable) then they will exist...the vigilante groups don't have enough power to stop them, Mehul can't have any more on his plate....The food is barely staying on as it is So it's either up to the individuals to take it on themselves to do what is right (as with life) or Mehul will have to get some help in...however even with this then alliances would still exist. The only true way for an alliance free utopia is for the individuals to stick to their own kd's. As long as there are those that are in alliances then there will always be those with more power than others, as long as this happens then there will always be those exploiting that power. The solution is the people...but they will never learn

*gets off the podium* Sorry for the long speech...guess I really shouldn't type when feeling unwell lol...hopefully at worst it'll prove an amusing read, hehe. Iguess the morale being that even though they are wrong they will exist, much like crime and to say they are not wrong because they exist is false.

[Admiral S3]

Tiny Tim:

Slow down there alittle son. I think you getting alittle out of control there. I think your taking what I said way out of context.

Quote:

That alliances are in thier basic design ment to help ensure that the rules are followed as Mehul has yet to impliment any such idea into the game.

Means just that. In thier ***"BASIC DESIGN"***. Helping ensure that people are following the rules or ideas of the game are ***"Basically"*** what alliances are intended to do. I at no time said thats what everyone of them does.

Quote:

Will there be any wars if everyone used your rules with 20 kingdom allies? Who are you to judge over what my kingdom does when we are at war? If an AA kingdom cant take the heat in a 1on1 war then suit themselfs. I have been hurt plenty of times war but thats the game.

To answer your questions, No there would not be any more alliance wars. Maybe its about time others followed our example. Who are we to judge? We are the ones who have been hit. Its not about damamge (I think many miss that) its about fair play. Alliances in general thier goal is to promote fiar play. Most alliances derive thier rules and regulations based on swirves rules and regulations. Yes this also inclued the AA.

************************************************** **********
To answer the 1st part of your speach there tiny, I did not want just substance, but proof. I will not launch a full scale investigation based on mear accusations alone. I do not have the time to do this. If I did I would never be posting here or anywhere else for that matter. If ***"Message"*** (something else obvisouly missed in the Admiral to everyone else translation) me with actual proof I will look into the matter and ***"If"*** we are in the wrong or that member or those members are in the wrong then the situation shall be dealt with in any manner we choose.

However PROOF IS NEEDED before I can do anything more then just reply to you.

[Admiral S3]

Dave:

You are annoying. I hence forth will not respond to you, unless you have something real to say. You obviously are unwilling to bend. Do not become a diplomat ever it would be a poor career choice.

No Alliances are not coded into the game, yet they do exist and therefore are part of the game.

NeoTaz:

Thanks for the post. Very good indeed. Want a job? LOL.

[NeoTaz]

As what?

PR rep....I mean, head Bull$!*3r? hehe

The morale was also that Mehul would ban alliances...If he implemntabley could ^_^